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Topic with many replies

The Increaingly Diverse Roskilde Festival


Author Message
Written on: 09.07.2012 22:46
Mikkel Storgaard Knudsen
Posts: 2
No, it really wasn't.

A good example was the "fashion" column in Orange Press. Every single model was a skinny white kid, no exceptions. Likewise with the SPEAK YOUR MIND-videos.

Also, the single representation of anything queer, not straight, was the article in Orange Press about the app Grindr. Whatever the point about this was I don't know, but to many people it was nothing but a "funny look at these gay people." Wow, how ballsy that the writer dared to go on a gay date wowowow!
Oh and also: Would it be so difficult for the editors, just for once to include a same-sex couple in the publications?
Because there sure was a monopoly of heterosexuality in the press material that I read.

It's time for Roskilde to decide whether it's for the straight white cis men, or for everyone.

Thanks icon_wink.gif



[This article was edited 1 times, at last 09.07.2012 at 22:49.]
Written on: 11.07.2012 13:55
Gitte Bjerring-Jensen
Posts: 75

Agree!! Mikkel Storgaard Knudsen

[This article was edited 1 times, at last 11.07.2012 at 13:56.]
Written on: 11.07.2012 14:02
Gitte Bjerring-Jensen
Posts: 75
You can also add, the festival radio's mainstream... bl.a. bl.a. ...

It is just not interesting anymore to listen too.. to much bl.a. bl.a...

where was the diverse in music aswell ?.. the same mainstream... music.. except for bloody good two hours of Rock/metal, punk, trash..RocknRoll...

why not show people that there is more to life than living in a little box.. ?

RF radio should be ahead, and show the way - Like discussions about sex, drugs,.. music.. instead of games.. and games.. and... seriously ... ? .... its fun to participate in.. but to listen to ?...

...
Written on: 11.07.2012 23:14
Macho
Posts: 153
I don't get this thread at all. If you want diversity go out and meet people on the festival don't base it on some paper or radio. I met all types of sexy, funny and weird people out there and a lot of queers too. They didn't seemed scared off by whatever you are talking about. And what's with all your hate against white skinny people - i love 'em!
Written on: 13.07.2012 20:54
Eef
Posts: 331
i agree with mikkel and gitte. For a festival like R F they should promote the diversity. Not as the article in the Orange press. But i guess thats what society turns now. Just sad to see IT happening at R F!!
Written on: 16.07.2012 08:51
Eef
Posts: 331
in my earlier post I was responding from my phone..so that was why it's short.
But: Grindr..come on people thats like soo 2009. I don't get it why you're writing an article about it. Especially because people get this freaking wrong image of homosexual people. It sucks big time!! I'm a lesbian..like care, I don't really. But the fact is that it's annoying to be compared to sime app which you can use to have sex with. Or that people can have a laugh with you because of the Grindr app.. what the ##$& I don't care. But i guess narrowminded people do!

About the festival radio..i don't listen to it'.But it would be interesting to have some discussions about the drug use indeed. Every year a lot of people die at roskilde. Because of the combination with drugs and alcohol. It would be interesting to get it out in the open and with a lot of new hard drugs arriving into Europe I guess it's kind of nessecary. Just a fun discussion, or maybe you could test the drugs on the radio!!! so then everyone knows what te effects are.

Or maybe you can have a stand that will test drugs... like we have on the dutch festivals!! (thats probably the only good thing we have!! compared to RF)
Written on: 16.07.2012 10:07
Kaneda
Posts: 382
Eef wrote:
Every year a lot of people die at roskilde. Because of the combination with drugs and alcohol.


The drug discussion is important, but as for those statements... No. And no.

2012: Swedish man died, according to papers by MDMA - rarely trust papers on those issues, but there's no doubt it was caused by drug use.
2011: German woman died by falling from the Tuborg tower. Unclear what the cause was, but autopsy revealed no drugs or alcohol in her blood.
2008: Norwegian man dies from heroin+cocaine overdose.
2004: Swedish man dies from a heart attack. Don't remember any cause of death ever coming out, so might assume it was simply a heart attack (otherwise the papers would be all over it)
2001: Swedish man dies from a heart attack. Not drug related.
2000: 9 people die at or after the Pearl Jam accident. Since this is the one incident where I was there, I think I can safely say that drug or alcohol use wasn't needed to die that night.

Before 2000, I remember one death during the 90's. May have been caused by drugs, may not. May have been more. Thing is, deaths happen in a city of 100000+ people, whether it's called Roskilde Festival or not. But "a lot of people" don't die there every year, and most of them don't die because of drugs - two drug related deaths in 12 years. Doesn't make them less tragic.

That said, the drug discussion is important, but really should have its own thread. Personally, I'm not sure the festival can (or should) do much about it that isn't being done already, except...

Or maybe you can have a stand that will test drugs... like we have on the dutch festivals!! (thats probably the only good thing we have!! compared to RF)


It is a good idea, but that's actually likely to cause a major political and media controversy with the current climate. A very much needed controversy, though, so maybe RF could be the catalyst for a debate here.

Anyway, diversity... Nothing new there. As discussed elsewhere, the festival hasn't really been "diverse" for a decade. In terms of nationality, race (although that never really was 'diverse'), lifestyle or sexuality. And the (now festival-managed) paper is almost worse than when Jyllands-Posten managed it in the late 90's. Although, unlike the JP festival paper, it hasn't resorted to hate columns. Yet. The festival radio has been redundant for about a decade too.

But just to reemphasize, Roskilde isn't for everyone - that's been the mantra since last year, and of course, it never was for everyone. That is to say, it's not for the narrow-minded or complacent. Or, at least, that's who the festival management now (finally) decided it isn't for, after they themselves began catering to those very people about 6-7 years ago. So at this point, the people it supposedly isn't for have a bit of a presence at the festival - which also means less room for the "different".

Let's hope they're successful in turning that around, because this Danish, white, hetero punk misses the diversity too. icon_wink.gif

[This article was edited 1 times, at last 16.07.2012 at 10:07.]
Written on: 16.07.2012 10:21
The Rehabilitation of Luis Suarez
Posts: 2506
Kaneda wrote:



But just to reemphasize, Roskilde isn't for everyone - that's been the mantra since last year, and of course, it never was for everyone. That is to say, it's not for the narrow-minded or complacent. Or, at least, that's who the festival management now (finally) decided it isn't for, after they themselves began catering to those very people about 6-7 years ago. So at this point, the people it supposedly isn't for have a bit of a presence at the festival - which also means less room for the "different".

Let's hope they're successful in turning that around, because this Danish, white, hetero punk misses the diversity too. icon_wink.gif


When did they address this thing? Never heard this, please tell me more. I really hope it is right. Too many simpletons at RF now- those should never be a target audience for the festival
Written on: 16.07.2012 11:01
Kaneda
Posts: 382
Top Secret Identity wrote:

When did they address this thing? Never heard this, please tell me more. I really hope it is right. Too many simpletons at RF now- those should never be a target audience for the festival


Started after the festival last year (and was misinterpreted, including by me, then), but Esben D. and the others (including Henrik R. even[*]) have been constantly saying "we want explorers; we want people who want to participate; we want people who wish to be challenged; we want people who don't come to hear the same thing" etc. etc. I read that (in my own optimistic way) as "we don't want the narrow-minded or complacent".

They've even admitted that things like Reboot camp - and even single day tickets - goes right against those ideals (although they insist single day tickets are necessary):

http://www.dr.dk/Nyheder/Kultur/Roskilde/Nyheder/2012/07/04/084208.htm (Danish only)

[*] Christina Bilde too, in her own corporate BS way, but I don't care for anything that comes out her mouth. Esben's years as official spokesperson look positively rock'n'roll in comparison.

[This article was edited 2 times, at last 16.07.2012 at 11:05.]
Written on: 16.07.2012 13:23
The Rehabilitation of Luis Suarez
Posts: 2506
Kaneda wrote:

Top Secret Identity wrote:

When did they address this thing? Never heard this, please tell me more. I really hope it is right. Too many simpletons at RF now- those should never be a target audience for the festival


Started after the festival last year (and was misinterpreted, including by me, then), but Esben D. and the others (including Henrik R. even[*]) have been constantly saying "we want explorers; we want people who want to participate; we want people who wish to be challenged; we want people who don't come to hear the same thing" etc. etc. I read that (in my own optimistic way) as "we don't want the narrow-minded or complacent".

They've even admitted that things like Reboot camp - and even single day tickets - goes right against those ideals (although they insist single day tickets are necessary):

http://www.dr.dk/Nyheder/Kultur/Roskilde/Nyheder/2012/07/04/084208.htm (Danish only)

[*] Christina Bilde too, in her own corporate BS way, but I don't care for anything that comes out her mouth. Esben's years as official spokesperson look positively rock'n'roll in comparison.


OK,

personally I don't see the problem with the "luxury" camping at all. People who wish so- why should that be a problem to me or the festival? Is there a law that at Roskilde people can't be comfortable?

I also don't think the people at H&M camp are the people, brats, who spoil the festival for many people. The pricks mostly camp elsewhere, without luxury.

IMHO of course icon_wink.gif
Written on: 16.07.2012 14:29
Christian Forslund
Posts: 342
Top Secret Identity wrote:

Kaneda wrote:

Top Secret Identity wrote:

When did they address this thing? Never heard this, please tell me more. I really hope it is right. Too many simpletons at RF now- those should never be a target audience for the festival


Started after the festival last year (and was misinterpreted, including by me, then), but Esben D. and the others (including Henrik R. even[*]) have been constantly saying "we want explorers; we want people who want to participate; we want people who wish to be challenged; we want people who don't come to hear the same thing" etc. etc. I read that (in my own optimistic way) as "we don't want the narrow-minded or complacent".

They've even admitted that things like Reboot camp - and even single day tickets - goes right against those ideals (although they insist single day tickets are necessary):

http://www.dr.dk/Nyheder/Kultur/Roskilde/Nyheder/2012/07/04/084208.htm (Danish only)

[*] Christina Bilde too, in her own corporate BS way, but I don't care for anything that comes out her mouth. Esben's years as official spokesperson look positively rock'n'roll in comparison.


OK,

personally I don't see the problem with the "luxury" camping at all. People who wish so- why should that be a problem to me or the festival? Is there a law that at Roskilde people can't be comfortable?

I also don't think the people at H&M camp are the people, brats, who spoil the festival for many people. The pricks mostly camp elsewhere, without luxury.

IMHO of course icon_wink.gif

Espen D said last year, that RF don't want customers but participants (i'm not sure how much he speaks for the festival and how much is his own brainfarts), when he spoke about it not being mom and dads festival anymore.
By that I guess he means that he prefere customers, which are actively part of the life at the camping, which the people at H&M obviously not are (maybe unlike the brats). So it makes sense for Espen.
Written on: 16.07.2012 14:48
Kaneda
Posts: 382
Top Secret Identity wrote:

OK,

personally I don't see the problem with the "luxury" camping at all. People who wish so- why should that be a problem to me or the festival? Is there a law that at Roskilde people can't be comfortable?

I also don't think the people at H&M camp are the people, brats, who spoil the festival for many people. The pricks mostly camp elsewhere, without luxury.

IMHO of course icon_wink.gif


Agreed about the pricks. That's not the problem with "luxury" camping - hence why we're not discussing pricks, but "diversity". icon_wink.gif I'll keep this short for once - H&M is just another symptom of the festival's strange audience profile the past 6-7 years (and with that, not with H&M Reboot itself, comes the pricks too). Discussed that at length elsewhere, just happy to see they're finally realizing it.
Written on: 16.07.2012 15:06
Eef
Posts: 331
ok well to get back o.t about the diversity thing... It's not like i expect a whole lot of RF but it's just that they are always pretending to be so openminded and cool during R.F. But they aren't.

As with the drug testing, you're probably right.

And whyyy was there an H& M reboot camp in the first place?? it's kind of strange isnt it?
Written on: 16.07.2012 16:14
The Rehabilitation of Luis Suarez
Posts: 2506
Kaneda wrote:

Top Secret Identity wrote:

OK,

personally I don't see the problem with the "luxury" camping at all. People who wish so- why should that be a problem to me or the festival? Is there a law that at Roskilde people can't be comfortable?

I also don't think the people at H&M camp are the people, brats, who spoil the festival for many people. The pricks mostly camp elsewhere, without luxury.

IMHO of course icon_wink.gif


Agreed about the pricks. That's not the problem with "luxury" camping - hence why we're not discussing pricks, but "diversity". icon_wink.gif I'll keep this short for once - H&M is just another symptom of the festival's strange audience profile the past 6-7 years (and with that, not with H&M Reboot itself, comes the pricks too). Discussed that at length elsewhere, just happy to see they're finally realizing it.


Alright, I understand icon_smile.gif And agree, mostly icon_wink.gif
Written on: 16.07.2012 16:18
The Rehabilitation of Luis Suarez
Posts: 2506
Christian Forslund wrote:

Top Secret Identity wrote:

Kaneda wrote:

Top Secret Identity wrote:

When did they address this thing? Never heard this, please tell me more. I really hope it is right. Too many simpletons at RF now- those should never be a target audience for the festival


Started after the festival last year (and was misinterpreted, including by me, then), but Esben D. and the others (including Henrik R. even[*]) have been constantly saying "we want explorers; we want people who want to participate; we want people who wish to be challenged; we want people who don't come to hear the same thing" etc. etc. I read that (in my own optimistic way) as "we don't want the narrow-minded or complacent".

They've even admitted that things like Reboot camp - and even single day tickets - goes right against those ideals (although they insist single day tickets are necessary):

http://www.dr.dk/Nyheder/Kultur/Roskilde/Nyheder/2012/07/04/084208.htm (Danish only)

[*] Christina Bilde too, in her own corporate BS way, but I don't care for anything that comes out her mouth. Esben's years as official spokesperson look positively rock'n'roll in comparison.


OK,

personally I don't see the problem with the "luxury" camping at all. People who wish so- why should that be a problem to me or the festival? Is there a law that at Roskilde people can't be comfortable?

I also don't think the people at H&M camp are the people, brats, who spoil the festival for many people. The pricks mostly camp elsewhere, without luxury.

IMHO of course icon_wink.gif

Espen D said last year, that RF don't want customers but participants (i'm not sure how much he speaks for the festival and how much is his own brainfarts), when he spoke about it not being mom and dads festival anymore.
By that I guess he means that he prefere customers, which are actively part of the life at the camping, which the people at H&M obviously not are (maybe unlike the brats). So it makes sense for Espen.


But what is a participant? I don't get it at all. Is it someone who pitches their own tent? Or makes a mess out of the camping area, or go to the various "cultural" events (which I personally is totally non interesting). Are you participating if you get dirty shoes and unwanted visitors in your tent going through your stuff?

Or is it someone who goes to the concerts, behaves well and contributes to a great atmosphere? If RF is about the music first and foremost- this is what should be their main focus.
Written on: 16.07.2012 16:19
Coldblooded
Posts: 1228
Kaneda wrote:


The drug discussion is important, but as for those statements... No. And no.

2012: Swedish man died, according to papers by MDMA - rarely trust papers on those issues, but there's no doubt it was caused by drug use.



Just a quick note: The papers initially reported that it was MDMA, but methamphetamine was later revealed to be the cause.
Written on: 16.07.2012 16:41
Rockmus
Posts: 290
Coldblooded wrote:

Kaneda wrote:


The drug discussion is important, but as for those statements... No. And no.

2012: Swedish man died, according to papers by MDMA - rarely trust papers on those issues, but there's no doubt it was caused by drug use.



Just a quick note: The papers initially reported that it was MDMA, but methamphetamine was later revealed to be the cause.


Now I don't know much about how drugs works, but what I heard was that it was polluted MDMA he died of - could that pollution be meth? ...although it seems strange to cut up a drug with another - that's not what pushers do on film!
Written on: 16.07.2012 17:26
Kaneda
Posts: 382
Coldblooded wrote:

Just a quick note: The papers initially reported that it was MDMA, but methamphetamine was later revealed to be the cause.


Thanks for the clarification. And yeah, more likely - hence why I added the "rarely trust papers" thing. I remember an article (not Roskilde related) about a decade ago claiming someone's beer had been poisoned with a drug that actually breaks down the instant it comes into contact with alcohol... Ah well.

Rockmus: Yes, the first story was "polluted MDMA", before it turned into "he died of MDMA", and now "methamphetamine". But yeah, it could still be MDMA polluted with meth - or just pure meth sold as MDMA. Meth is much cheaper to produce and has some effects in common with MDMA.

Top Secret Identity wrote:
But what is a participant? I don't get it at all. Is it someone who pitches their own tent? Or makes a mess out of the camping area, or go to the various "cultural" events (which I personally is totally non interesting). Are you participating if you get dirty shoes and unwanted visitors in your tent going through your stuff?


A bit of rambling here...

A participant, as opposed to a customer, is someone who takes part. In shaping the festival, in making it a good experience, etc. I think I made the distinction in a different way, a couple of years before the festival decided it was a good idea: The participant may provide ideas that the festival might take into account, if it fits with the festival's ideals. The customer, however, is always right.

It's the customer view that creates Reboot Camp ('we provide it, because some customers want it'). It's also the customer view that invites the brats to ruin it for everyone else - with the idea that, well, they're customers - they paid for their ticket - so now they can do whatever the hell they want. RF was never about customers until the management made it so. Deciding that was a wrong direction is probably a step in the right direction. icon_wink.gif

I don't care particularly much for the cultural events either - more for the architecture and visual/auditory art around the site - I need that to put the music into context. But the point is that everything Roskilde is made up of dictates what audience they'll get in the end. That includes the lineup, the events, the art, the architecture, the warm-up days... The (composition of the) audience, in turn, makes a huge mark - for better or worse - on any single participant's experience.

And when "what Roskilde is made up of" points in all kinds of vague directions (because they're trying to cater to all their potential customers), we'll get a lot of people who don't care for any of it in particular. Those will make their own party instead, often by way of being a nuisance to anyone else, because while they're pretty much all mainstream youth, they share no common values whatsoever - they all came for a different thing.

Perfect example (not talking brats here, just 'stuff pointing in all kinds of vague directions'): Promilleservice. A bunch of electronica fans make their own party. When the festival stops giving them special treatment, effectively shutting them down, what was the main argument? "Promilleservice was just adding the party that the festival doesn't provide - now there's nothing for us". If the festival doesn't provide it, and there's nothing else for you, why are you even here? Right, because the festival catered slightly to you, you decided it wasn't enough and you didn't care for the rest, so you made your own party.

Also... Remove all the culture (art, events, everything) and focus on "what matters": the music and the beer. Stripping away everything else would move the emphasis to making money and to a customer mindset (after all, what's left, music and beer, is what the customer specifically paid for). Something Leif Skov talked about in an interview in the 90's (I think it can be found somewhere on DR bonanza) - if people get the idea that the festival is just working to empty their wallets, no matter if it goes to charity, the mood on the festival site would turn negative pretty quickly. Making it a nice and stimulating place to be - beyond "what was in the brochure" and regardless of whether you or I care for certain parts of it - is absolutely essential for the Roskilde feeling.

[This article was edited 5 times, at last 16.07.2012 at 17:46.]
Written on: 16.07.2012 19:20
Macho
Posts: 153
...and what was the topic again?
Written on: 16.07.2012 22:33
Eef
Posts: 331
ok but this is part of the topic.. right? icon_wink.gif


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