Roskilde Festivals diskussionforum

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Written on: 26.04.2012 14:03
Martin Horn Pedersen
Posts: 1267
Here are some basic infomation, that will make the life on the forum more fun for both your and the other users:

About the forum:

- write in English please
- try to have a clean language
- make your best effort to in a mature manner get you point accross

The bands/booking

  • The big Danish festivals don’t share international names – check smukfest.dk ,skivefestival.dk, northside.dk & jellingmusikfestival.dk before asking for a band.

    Band need to be on tour in Europa about the period where Roskilde is. So don’t ask for band there are not touring or in another part of the world – check the bands homepage

    Check if the band is free – a band don’t play 5 days in a row

    Roskilde normally don’t book the same bands 2 year in a row(there are few exceptions)

    Bands are booked if: They have new album out, on a reunion tour or is very big/special/unik (Like RATM, Prince and so on)

    The festival wants to book RATM , but Rage need to be in Europa around the festival for it to happen.


Plz post if you go more there needs to get on here (or if you think it need to be in another part of the forum, was not sure where to post it)
Written on: 26.04.2012 14:30
The Rehabilitation of Luis Suarez
Posts: 2506
Martin Horn Pedersen wrote:

  • The big Danish festivals don’t share international names – check smukfest.dk , northside.dk & jellingmusikfestival.dk before asking for a band.

    Band need to be on tour in Europa about the period where Roskilde is. So don’t ask for band there are not touring or in another part of the world – check the bands homepage

    Check if the band is free – a band don’t play 5 days in a row

    Roskilde normally don’t book the same bands 2 year in a row(there are few exceptions)

    Bands are only booked if: They have new album out, on a reunion tour or is very big/special (Like RATM)

    The festival wants to book RATM , but Rage need to be in Europa around the festival for it to happen.


Plz post if you go more there needs to get on here (or if you think it need to be in another part of the forum, was not sure where to post it)



- On this forum we shall not jump on newbies, but rather try to- gently and respectfully- get them up to speed.
Written on: 26.04.2012 14:39
Martin Horn Pedersen
Posts: 1267
Robbie Fowler is God wrote:


- On this forum we shall not jump on newbies, but rather try to- gently and respectfully- get them up to speed.


I think that is more a subjekt for debat about a code of conduct or some think like that for the use of the forum. And I think a debat about that can be good, but this is for info. But use can make a new tread about it?
Written on: 26.04.2012 14:44
The Rehabilitation of Luis Suarez
Posts: 2506
Martin Horn Pedersen wrote:

Robbie Fowler is God wrote:


- On this forum we shall not jump on newbies, but rather try to- gently and respectfully- get them up to speed.


I think that is more a subjekt for debat about a code of conduct or some think like that for the use of the forum. And I think a debat about that can be good, but this is for info. But use can make a new tread about it?


I am a bit unsure what your thread is about (serious here)

Is it what to expect from the bookings?

Is it generall information about the festival?

Written on: 26.04.2012 14:48
Martin Horn Pedersen
Posts: 1267
Bookings.

That why I but it in Rumours, hopes & wishes.

My hope is go give new users the basic infomation so old grumpy men like me dont need to get angry when the post band wishes and so on that will not happen, and guys like you dont need to tell me that I am unfriendly.
Written on: 26.04.2012 15:07
The Rehabilitation of Luis Suarez
Posts: 2506
Martin Horn Pedersen wrote:

Bookings.

That why I but it in Rumours, hopes & wishes.

My hope is go give new users the basic infomation so old grumpy men like me dont need to get angry when the post band wishes and so on that will not happen, and guys like you dont need to tell me that I am unfriendly.


Don't ask for Britney Spears? icon_wink.gif
Written on: 26.04.2012 15:16
Martin Horn Pedersen
Posts: 1267
Now I put ure lines form your and Colds debat in.
So now it got a bit of basic forum info. But most about booking and bands.
Written on: 26.04.2012 15:18
The Rehabilitation of Luis Suarez
Posts: 2506
I like this project! Kudos icon_smile.gif
Written on: 26.04.2012 17:54
Ktadie
Posts: 31
Martin Horn Pedersen wrote:

Here are some basic infomation, that will make the life on the forum more fun for both your and the other users:

About the forum:

- write in English please
- try to have a clean language
- make your best effort to in a mature manner get you point accross

The bands/booking

  • The big Danish festivals don’t share international names – check smukfest.dk , northside.dk & jellingmusikfestival.dk before asking for a band.

    Band need to be on tour in Europa about the period where Roskilde is. So don’t ask for band there are not touring or in another part of the world – check the bands homepage

    Check if the band is free – a band don’t play 5 days in a row

    Roskilde normally don’t book the same bands 2 year in a row(there are few exceptions)

    Bands are only booked if: They have new album out, on a reunion tour or is very big/special (Like RATM)

    The festival wants to book RATM , but Rage need to be in Europa around the festival for it to happen.


Plz post if you go more there needs to get on here (or if you think it need to be in another part of the forum, was not sure where to post it)


Honestly Martin, I understand your frustrations as a hardcore user on this forum,
however, you should go through your posts and check for grammatical errors in order to be taken seriously on an English speaking forum.
Written on: 26.04.2012 20:11
Martin Horn Pedersen
Posts: 1267
Ktadie wrote:

Martin Horn Pedersen wrote:

Here are some basic infomation, that will make the life on the forum more fun for both your and the other users:

About the forum:

- write in English please
- try to have a clean language
- make your best effort to in a mature manner get you point accross

The bands/booking

  • The big Danish festivals don’t share international names – check smukfest.dk , northside.dk & jellingmusikfestival.dk before asking for a band.

    Band need to be on tour in Europa about the period where Roskilde is. So don’t ask for band there are not touring or in another part of the world – check the bands homepage

    Check if the band is free – a band don’t play 5 days in a row

    Roskilde normally don’t book the same bands 2 year in a row(there are few exceptions)

    Bands are only booked if: They have new album out, on a reunion tour or is very big/special (Like RATM)

    The festival wants to book RATM , but Rage need to be in Europa around the festival for it to happen.


Plz post if you go more there needs to get on here (or if you think it need to be in another part of the forum, was not sure where to post it)


Honestly Martin, I understand your frustrations as a hardcore user on this forum,
however, you should go through your posts and check for grammatical errors in order to be taken seriously on an English speaking forum.


I think ppl take me very seriously here and understand what I am writing. And no it is not perfect and it will not be, be cores I got Dyslexia(mostly only the spelling part.. the English word covers much more than the Danish "ordblind" but if someone feel like fixing the errors in a post like this, feel free and I will post the edit
Written on: 26.04.2012 20:23
Lord Beef Jerky
Posts: 1507
Martin Horn Pedersen wrote:

I think ppl take we ppl take we very seriously here


Don't wanna be an ass, and I take you seriously no matter how you spell, but that sentence made me laugh a bit icon_biggrin.gif

And yeah, we understand you perfectly well, so don't worry, mate.
Written on: 26.04.2012 20:36
Martin Horn Pedersen
Posts: 1267
Lord Beef Jerky wrote:

Martin Horn Pedersen wrote:

I think ppl take we ppl take we very seriously here


Don't wanna be an ass, and I take you seriously no matter how you spell, but that sentence made me laugh a bit icon_biggrin.gif

And yeah, we understand you perfectly well, so don't worry, mate.


Hehe yeah that was fucked...fixed icon_wink.gif and thx
Written on: 03.05.2012 12:36
Niklas Birksted
Posts: 79
Martin Horn Pedersen wrote:

My hope is go give new users the basic infomation so old grumpy men like me dont need to get angry when the post band wishes and so on that will not happen, and guys like you dont need to tell me that I am unfriendly.


This is a good initiative, but Martin, and i can tell you this from working with management for +10 years, a post like this is going to make little to no difference at all. The people who don't find facts before they post, sure as hell arent going to read this post before they make a new topic, wishing for RHCP, RATM or Daft Punk.

Just accept it, stupid people stay stupid, use your energy finding a way to deal w stupid, instead of making a codex, obviously very few a reading and fewer will be using.
Written on: 03.05.2012 12:58
Niklas Birksted
Posts: 79
Martin Horn Pedersen wrote:

[list]
The big Danish festivals don’t share international names – check smukfest.dk , northside.dk & jellingmusikfestival.dk before asking for a band.


You should prob add skivefestival and wonderfestiwall to this one. Also, they do share if they can.


Band need to be on tour in Europa about the period where Roskilde is. So don’t ask for band there are not touring or in another part of the world – check the bands homepage


Good point, i am very interested in seeing how Apparatjik will pull this off tho, as they are playing in the middle of Coldplays US tour


Check if the band is free – a band don’t play 5 days in a row


Good point


Roskilde normally don’t book the same bands 2 year in a row(there are few exceptions)


Hmmm, i have a feeling, if we look thru the years, we're prob gonna find quite a few exceptions, but in general will be true for headliners and bigger international names. Recent years, Janelle & Den Sorte Skole have done this (i think DSS played 3 years straight, incl their gig at the skate scene, right?)


Bands are only booked if: They have new album out, on a reunion tour or is very big/special (Like RATM)


No, this is not true, bands are booked if they can give something to the festival. Prince, Apparatjik and i am sure there's even more if i dive into it. Roskilde Festival have a unique way of gathering very special acts and artists, just for them. Probably one of the things that makes Roskilde stand out from a lot of other festivals... (and the orange color, always liked that icon_wink.gif)

This is probably the reason people keep wishing for RATM and Daft Punk, because they expect Roskilde can make it happen. And they will.... just not right now icon_razz.gif
Written on: 04.05.2012 07:53
Kaneda
Posts: 382
Niklas Birksted wrote:


Roskilde normally don’t book the same bands 2 year in a row(there are few exceptions)


Hmmm, i have a feeling, if we look thru the years, we're prob gonna find quite a few exceptions, but in general will be true for headliners and bigger international names. Recent years, Janelle & Den Sorte Skole have done this (i think DSS played 3 years straight, incl their gig at the skate scene, right?)


Just for the statistic fun... Ignoring any unofficial stages (e.g. the skate stage). Also skipping the 70's, when the reappearances were constant. Not including bookings that followed a cancellation the year before (there have been five of those). Numbers in parantheses indicate more than two consecutive years. [C] indicates rebooked after camping stage/pavillion jr. appearance.

1979-1981: Delta Blues Band (3)

1980-1981: Anne Linnet Band
1980-1982: Malurt (3)
1980-1981: Pia Raug & Finn Olafson
1980-1982: Gnags (3)
1980-1981: Poder Popular

1981-1983: Kliché (3)
1981-1983: Sneakers (3)
1981-1982: Voxpop

1982-1983: Mek Pek Party Band
1982-1983: Before
1982-1983: Erik Grip m/Band

1983-1984: Warm Guns
1983-1985: TV-2 (3)
1983-1984: Freja
1983-1984: Lars Lilholt Band
1983-1984: Tøbrud

1984-1987: Anne Linnet & Marquis de Sade (4)

1985-1986: Billy Bragg
1985-1986: Rasmus Lyberth
1985-1986: Gangway

1986-1987: Thomas Helmig
1986-1987: Dream Syndicate

1987-1988: Sort Sol
1987-1988: Miss B. Haven
1987-1989: The Sandmen (3)

1988-1990: D-A-D (3)
1988-1989: The Georgia Satellites

1989-1990: Sharing Patrol
1989-1990: Mikael Wiehe
1989-1990: Simcess

1990-1994: Skanbeat (5)
1990-1991: The Orb
1990-1991: Malurt

1991-1993: Boghandle (3)
1991-1992: Fielfraz

1992-1993: The Poets
1992-1994: Trains & Boats & Planes (3)

1993-1994: Kinky Boot Beast
1993-1994: Levellers
1993-1996: Dizzy Mizz Lizzy (4)
1993-1994: Hedningarna
1993-1994: Eva Kaldan
1993-1994: The Sandals
1993-1994: The Sandmen
1993-1994: Clawfinger

1994-1995: Sick of It All
1994-1995: DJ Typhoon
1994-1995: Ben Harper
1994-1995: Papkasseshow
1994-1995: Sigurd Barrett
1994-1995: Elvis Costello & the Attractions
1994-1999: Psyched Up Janis (6)

1995-1996: The Cardigans
1995-1996: D-A-D
1995-1997: Pretty Maids (3)
1995-1996: Hotel Hunger
1995-1996: Strawberry Slaughterhouse

1996-1997: Passion Orange
1996-1997: Nick Cave & The Bad Seeds
1996-1997: LTJ Bukem & MC Conrad
1996-1997: Düreforsög

1997-1998: Sorten Muld
1997-1998: DJ Schack

1998-1999: On Trial
1998-1999: DJ 360°
1998-1999: TV-2
1998-1999: Kashmir
1998-1999: Bjørn Svin

1999-2000: Superheroes
1999-2000: DJ Lab
1999-2000: The Flaming Lips
1999-2000: The Burnouts

2000-2001: Wynona [C]
2000-2001: Madrugada
2000-2001: The Flaming Sideburns
2000-2001: Tiësto

2001-2002: Saybia [C]
2001-2002: Danko Jones
2001-2002: Manu Chao
2001-2002: Swan Lee

2002-2004: Baby Woodrose (3) [C]
2002-2003: Kaizers Orchestra
2002-2003: The Raveonettes

2003-2004: Tiger Tunes [C]
2003-2004: Afel Bocoum

2005-2006: Toumani Diabaté

2006-2007: Band Ane [C]
2006-2007: Dúné [C]
2006-2007: Volbeat
2006-2007: Arctic Monkeys
2006-2007: HateSphere
2006-2007: Justice

2007-2008: Choir of Young Believers [C]

2008-2009: Lucy Love [C]
2008-2009: August
2008-2009: Stella Polaris Sound System
2008-2009: Lulu Rouge

2009-2010: Kellermensch [C]
2009-2010: Den Sorte Skole

2010-2011: Iceage [C]


ETA: Justice - one of the few acts that haven't yet been split out in the database, and thus appear as two different artists at the moment (they were billed along with a couple of other acts in 2006).

[This article was edited 4 times, at last 04.05.2012 at 17:37.]
Written on: 04.05.2012 10:30
The Rehabilitation of Luis Suarez
Posts: 2506
Kaneda wrote:

Niklas Birksted wrote:


Roskilde normally don’t book the same bands 2 year in a row(there are few exceptions)


Hmmm, i have a feeling, if we look thru the years, we're prob gonna find quite a few exceptions, but in general will be true for headliners and bigger international names. Recent years, Janelle & Den Sorte Skole have done this (i think DSS played 3 years straight, incl their gig at the skate scene, right?)


Just for the statistic fun... Ignoring any unofficial stages (e.g. the skate stage). Also skipping the 70's, when the reappearances were constant. Not including bookings that followed a cancellation the year before (there have been five of those). Numbers in parantheses indicate more than two consecutive years. [C] indicates rebooked after camping stage/pavillion jr. appearance.

1979-1981: Delta Blues Band (3)

1980-1981: Anne Linnet Band
1980-1982: Malurt (3)
1980-1981: Pia Raug & Finn Olafson
1980-1982: Gnags (3)
1980-1981: Poder Popular

1981-1983: Kliché (3)
1981-1983: Sneakers (3)
1981-1982: Voxpop

1982-1983: Mek Pek Party Band
1982-1983: Before
1982-1983: Erik Grip m/Band

1983-1984: Warm Guns
1983-1985: TV-2 (3)
1983-1984: Freja
1983-1984: Lars Lilholt Band
1983-1984: Tøbrud

1984-1987: Anne Linnet & Marquis de Sade (4)

1985-1986: Billy Bragg
1985-1986: Rasmus Lyberth
1985-1986: Gangway

1986-1987: Thomas Helmig
1986-1987: Dream Syndicate

1987-1988: Sort Sol
1987-1988: Miss B. Haven
1987-1989: The Sandmen (3)

1988-1990: D-A-D (3)
1988-1989: The Georgia Satellites

1989-1990: Sharing Patrol
1989-1990: Mikael Wiehe
1989-1990: Simcess

1990-1994: Skanbeat (5)
1990-1991: The Orb
1990-1991: Malurt

1991-1993: Boghandle (3)
1991-1992: Fielfraz

1992-1993: The Poets
1992-1994: Trains & Boats & Planes (3)

1993-1994: Kinky Boot Beast
1993-1994: Levellers
1993-1996: Dizzy Mizz Lizzy (4)
1993-1994: Hedningarna
1993-1994: Eva Kaldan
1993-1994: The Sandals
1993-1994: The Sandmen
1993-1994: Clawfinger

1994-1995: Sick of It All
1994-1995: DJ Typhoon
1994-1995: Ben Harper
1994-1995: Papkasseshow
1994-1995: Sigurd Barrett
1994-1995: Elvis Costello & the Attractions
1994-1999: Psyched Up Janis (6)

1995-1996: The Cardigans
1995-1996: D-A-D
1995-1997: Pretty Maids (3)
1995-1996: Hotel Hunger
1995-1996: Strawberry Slaughterhouse

1996-1997: Passion Orange
1996-1997: Nick Cave & The Bad Seeds
1996-1997: LTJ Bukem & MC Conrad
1996-1997: Düreforsög

1997-1998: Sorten Muld
1997-1998: DJ Schack

1998-1999: On Trial
1998-1999: DJ 360°
1998-1999: TV-2
1998-1999: Kashmir
1998-1999: Bjørn Svin

1999-2000: Superheroes
1999-2000: DJ Lab
1999-2000: The Flaming Lips
1999-2000: The Burnouts

2000-2001: Wynona [C]
2000-2001: Madrugada
2000-2001: The Flaming Sideburns
2000-2001: Tiësto

2001-2002: Saybia [C]
2001-2002: Danko Jones
2001-2002: Manu Chao
2001-2002: Swan Lee

2002-2004: Baby Woodrose (3) [C]
2002-2003: Kaizers Orchestra
2002-2003: The Raveonettes

2003-2004: Tiger Tunes [C]
2003-2004: Afel Bocoum

2005-2006: Toumani Diabaté

2006-2007: Band Ane [C]
2006-2007: Dúné [C]
2006-2007: Volbeat
2006-2007: Arctic Monkeys
2006-2007: HateSphere

2007-2008: Choir of Young Believers [C]

2008-2009: Lucy Love [C]
2008-2009: August
2008-2009: Stella Polaris Sound System
2008-2009: Lulu Rouge

2009-2010: Kellermensch [C]
2009-2010: Den Sorte Skole

2010-2011: Iceage [C]



Thanks for the list. Didn't Suede play two years in a row in the 90's? Year 2 they had 3 different shows. Am I right?
Written on: 04.05.2012 11:25
Coldblooded
Posts: 1228
Suarez wrote:

Thanks for the list. Didn't Suede play two years in a row in the 90's? Year 2 they had 3 different shows. Am I right?

ALMOST right icon_smile.gif

They played in 1997 and 1999. 1999 was indeed the year where they did a Suarez.

[This article was edited 1 times, at last 04.05.2012 at 11:26.]
Written on: 04.05.2012 11:27
Bongo Anders
Posts: 1154
Mek Pek Party Band
Papkasseshow
Sigurd Barrett

Whaaaattt icon_eek.gif
Written on: 04.05.2012 11:43
Coldblooded
Posts: 1228
Niklas Birksted wrote:

Martin Horn Pedersen wrote:

[list]
The big Danish festivals don’t share international names – check smukfest.dk , northside.dk & jellingmusikfestival.dk before asking for a band.


You should prob add skivefestival and wonderfestiwall to this one. Also, they do share if they can.


Band need to be on tour in Europa about the period where Roskilde is. So don’t ask for band there are not touring or in another part of the world – check the bands homepage


Good point, i am very interested in seeing how Apparatjik will pull this off tho, as they are playing in the middle of Coldplays US tour


Check if the band is free – a band don’t play 5 days in a row


Good point


Roskilde normally don’t book the same bands 2 year in a row(there are few exceptions)


Hmmm, i have a feeling, if we look thru the years, we're prob gonna find quite a few exceptions, but in general will be true for headliners and bigger international names. Recent years, Janelle & Den Sorte Skole have done this (i think DSS played 3 years straight, incl their gig at the skate scene, right?)


Bands are only booked if: They have new album out, on a reunion tour or is very big/special (Like RATM)


No, this is not true, bands are booked if they can give something to the festival. Prince, Apparatjik and i am sure there's even more if i dive into it. Roskilde Festival have a unique way of gathering very special acts and artists, just for them. Probably one of the things that makes Roskilde stand out from a lot of other festivals... (and the orange color, always liked that icon_wink.gif)

This is probably the reason people keep wishing for RATM and Daft Punk, because they expect Roskilde can make it happen. And they will.... just not right now icon_razz.gif

I don't consider Wonderfestiwall a big Danish festival. It's more or less the same size as Danmarks Grimmeste or Alive Festival. IMO the "big ones" are "the five"; Roskilde, Skanderborg, Northside, Skive and Jelling. Also, Wonderfestiwall don't book many international names (outside of Scandinavia) and even fewer names that could be considered headliners, so the point is kinda moot.

You have one part of the explanation for the festivals not sharing headliners right; that the bands want to spread out their touring, so they don't visit the same places unnecessarily often, but also, the festivals put in contractual clauses, so the bands are barred from playing in near vicinity to the event, timewise aswell as geographically. Roskilde had Arctic Monkeys exclusively for Scandinavia last year, while Metaltown in Göteborg for example "owned" System of a Down. It protects their ticket sales.

As for your last paragraph, Apparatjik actually has a new album out right now, but yeah, otherwise I agree. USUALLY though, a band only tours because there is a reason to, and that reason is often the promotion of a new album.

[This article was edited 1 times, at last 04.05.2012 at 11:45.]
Written on: 04.05.2012 12:15
Martin Horn Pedersen
Posts: 1267
Niklas Birksted wrote:

Martin Horn Pedersen wrote:

My hope is go give new users the basic infomation so old grumpy men like me dont need to get angry when the post band wishes and so on that will not happen, and guys like you dont need to tell me that I am unfriendly.


This is a good initiative, but Martin, and i can tell you this from working with management for +10 years, a post like this is going to make little to no difference at all. The people who don't find facts before they post, sure as hell arent going to read this post before they make a new topic, wishing for RHCP, RATM or Daft Punk.

Just accept it, stupid people stay stupid, use your energy finding a way to deal w stupid, instead of making a codex, obviously very few a reading and fewer will be using.


A part of the point is that now it is easy for me(and other) to just post a link to this tread when ppl say "book Blur" or what ever they say this year, so it is a way of deadling w stupid icon_smile.gif (and the post got 672 views atm, so some read it)
Written on: 04.05.2012 16:02
Niklas Birksted
Posts: 79
Kaneda wrote:


Just for the statistic fun...


Impressive work dude! How long did this take you?

Coldblooded wrote:

It protects their ticket sales.


Did not know about the 'exclusive' part, good point, thank you

Martin Horn Pedersen wrote:

A part of the point is that now it is easy for me(and other) to just post a link to this tread when ppl say "book Blur" or what ever they say this year, so it is a way of deadling w stupid (and the post got 672 views atm, so some read it)


Yeah, i know, it'd be a lot easier for ppl reading a lot in here, if threads where kept to a relevant minimum.

[This article was edited 2 times, at last 04.05.2012 at 16:06.]
Written on: 04.05.2012 17:00
The Rehabilitation of Luis Suarez
Posts: 2506
Coldblooded wrote:

Suarez wrote:

Thanks for the list. Didn't Suede play two years in a row in the 90's? Year 2 they had 3 different shows. Am I right?

ALMOST right icon_smile.gif

They played in 1997 and 1999. 1999 was indeed the year where they did a Suarez.


Thank God (Fowler) for Suarez!

Forza negro!
Written on: 04.05.2012 17:20
Kaneda
Posts: 382
Niklas Birksted wrote:

Impressive work dude! How long did this take you?


About 5 minutes. icon_cool.gif

With the Roskilde history database that was prepared a long time ago for a project that's on hold, it was just a matter of "coming up with" the SQL ("database speak" ). Same thing with the "how many acts were booked each year?" in some other thread, as well as "percentage of Danish acts each year" in another.

bongo anders wrote:

Mek Pek Party Band
Papkasseshow
Sigurd Barrett

Whaaaattt icon_eek.gif


The latter two appeared on the Cabaret stage, which was mostly a "take a break from all the rock and stuff" stage - a lot of the acts appeared multiple times each year. Barrett did a piano based musical comedy show, a bit like what Bill Bailey does these days. Did catch one of them in '95 - it was actually quite fun. icon_smile.gif Papkasseshow and Mek Pek... Yeah... But who knows? I never felt Thomas Helmig belonged either, but that was only until seeing some booking choices of the 00's.
Written on: 13.05.2013 13:01
Ruslabox
Posts: 168
2011-2012: Janelle Monnae

2012-2013: Eloq (C)
2012-2013: Linkoban (C)

[This article was edited 1 times, at last 13.05.2013 at 19:44.]


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