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Topic with many replies

The influx of sound systems are raping festival life


Author Message
Written on: 12.07.2012 01:11
Martin Horn Pedersen
Official RF person
Posts: 1273
Coldblooded wrote:

Saturnus, could you edit your link? It borks the layout.


Bether? I know it is not 100%
Written on: 12.07.2012 11:03
Christiiine
Posts: 21
I think I had the worst soundsystem as a neighbour, it was called apollo and was Roskildes own soundsystem. it destroyed my festival from wednesday until sunday. I would be so happy to hear all the boominators instead.
Written on: 12.07.2012 13:26
Christian
Posts: 106
Christiiine wrote:

I think I had the worst soundsystem as a neighbour, it was called apollo and was Roskildes own soundsystem. it destroyed my festival from wednesday until sunday. I would be so happy to hear all the boominators instead.


Yeah, you lived right in the line of fire. I noticed your camp when we walked by and I remember thinking that you would have had to leave your camp whenever the music was playing on Apollo. If I were you I would write the festival and ask for a refund (or maybe just a ticket for next year?) because of it.

We lived in C65 (maybe 200 meter to the side of the stage) and I almost couldn't fall asleep saturday night even though I was drunk as a skunk. The air mattress just kept bouncing and that is not supposed to be happening unless I am the one making it bounce!
Written on: 12.07.2012 14:10
jazon
Posts: 55
Christian wrote:

Christiiine wrote:

I think I had the worst soundsystem as a neighbour, it was called apollo and was Roskildes own soundsystem. it destroyed my festival from wednesday until sunday. I would be so happy to hear all the boominators instead.


Yeah, you lived right in the line of fire. I noticed your camp when we walked by and I remember thinking that you would have had to leave your camp whenever the music was playing on Apollo. If I were you I would write the festival and ask for a refund (or maybe just a ticket for next year?) because of it.

We lived in C65 (maybe 200 meter to the side of the stage) and I almost couldn't fall asleep saturday night even though I was drunk as a skunk. The air mattress just kept bouncing and that is not supposed to be happening unless I am the one making it bounce!


if you cant beet them join them !!! i lovd apollo !!! yhhee had some trubel sleeping 1 or 2 times but if you cant sleep wake the fuck up and party !!!
Written on: 12.07.2012 17:05
Alex Langberg
Posts: 13
What happened to the concept of loud enough? We have a small boomblaster and a bigger backpack, both home-built, based on digital amps and SLA batteries/solar cells. The boomblaster plays loud enough during the day for 20 people to listen to the radio or their own music at reasonable levels at a quite high sound quality. The backpack can easily play up a party of 30 people. I could carry both on my bike without a problem if I wanted to. It's loud enough.

Now, I'm all up for larger stereos. There just has to be a reason. I love the Boominator, the Coffin, Kilowattgruppen, Karmakanonen etc. I've even seen a dollhouse with speakers in the windows, Thomas the Train, the tower from Mordor and even an old piano with speakers built in, that was almost impossible to move. I probably forgot a lot of the amazing stereos you see out there but many of them are amazing in their own regard. Some because of the sheer technical ingenuity such as the first ones mentioned and some because of the artistical skill involved as in the last ones mentioned. Some because of the amazing level of pure, intentional stupidity, such as the piano. In my world all these have something in common - they make you stop and wonder and laugh in amazement. You want to take pictures, talk to the creators and bring your friends to see it. It's very much in the spirit of the festival, because it brings people together. I love that part of it.

What I don't like is the now huge amount of stereos that are simply made to play loud. I have no count of how many camps I have walked past who have big horns or maybe just a box the size of a car, with a tower of car/truck batteries next to it. They turn the stereo out towards everybody else and play so loud music that you will damage your hearing just walking past it. While they all sit in their camp, just chilling on the other side of the speakers. Yes, your stereo can play really loud. Big deal. It's not amazing or fascinating in any kind of way. We passed the "wow, that stereo is loud"-point many years ago. It's like people think that a big, loud stereo will be enough to start a party by itself.

There are many problems with this:

1. The louder you play, the bigger your responsibility for the people around you. These stereos play insanely loud and will damage your and everyone else's ears while making people around you unable to sleep. Often for no reason at all. It's my impression that the sound pressure level is a lot higher than in front of the orange stage and often with distortion that makes it a lot worse. Yet there are no sound engineers to ensure that people will not get hurt. I know that many of the camps I have mentioned before actively monitor their stereos during parties to make sure everybody has a good time but it is my impression that a vast majority of the camps with loud stereos don't care about others at all.

2. It's in no way good for the environment. I used to work as an orange vest and I was amazed that people would sometimes just dump their car batteries. Just throw them in the mud so they turned over and the acid ran out in the ground. Then we'd have to pick them up and carry them all the way to the tower. With the invention of digital amplifiers, I have a hard time finding any rational argument why unsealed batteries should still be allowed - especially at a festival that focuses so much on the environment. You can easily make do with SLA batteries or different variations of lithium-batteries. With a digital amp, it's actually cheaper in the long run. Also, extreme amounts of energy is wasted that could simply be collected by solar cells instead.

3. This is definitely an arms race that will only turn worse every year. It already is. I fear that the end result might be a ban on sound systems or partial bans that take the fun out of it. Like, almost all other festivals.

So what can we do?

I think the festival should take the competitive element of it and make it theirs. Change the competition from being about playing the loudest and turn it into a contest of being innovative, environmental and creative. Like, you know, everything else on the festival. Give us challenges. Enforce a ban on unsealed batteries. Enforce volume restrictions. Make it such that stereos larger than what one person can lift requires review from the festival in advance. Make it a privilege to have a big stereo. Make competitions about who can play the loudest for the longest on 10 AAA batteries. There are so many options. It's all about being unique and rules can often create enormous sparks of creativity. I'd gladly help. Just, please, do SOMETHING before it gets out of hand. It's already something that's really unique to this festival. Please embrace it before you have to reject it completely like other festivals do.

[This article was edited 1 times, at last 12.07.2012 at 17:06.]
Written on: 12.07.2012 17:17
Schwing
Posts: 8
Edit: I haven't time to read Alex Langbergs post - we posted at the same time so there might be slight risk of me repeating him - dunno

Well where to start...

It seems like there is some sort of problem with all the soundsystems - It also seems like some part of the problem could be solved by increasing sound quality and avoid repetition of the same songs, but most of the answers in this thread blame selfish douchebag-camps - camps that I somehow seem to be the incarnation of on this forum, more of that later. I pointed out that politeness was part of the problem but as Ulrik Rasmussen mentioned: Some people are just beyond reasoning and I'm sorry to hear that you lived next to such camp Ulrik.
To prevent such things happen next year (We can, however, never totally prevent it) I believe many of the solutions in this thread are great: A growth in silent and clean area, especially combined with a loud and dirty area. That would require some sort of 'patrolling' and enforcing in the 'normal' and S&C areas, but it should be possible. An easy-to-get permit as Saturnus suggested could probably also decrease the growth of soundsystems. Some kind of reward or 'carrot' as Hed mentioned, could also be a good solution I think, but how it should work I really don't know, and it probably can't stand alone.

Slight of topic: Christian with the guitar, are you up for a little challenge? Try to make an discription of me as a festival goer: Where do I camp t? What music do I hear on my stero? What did I hear on the stages this year/or what would I like to hear on the stages? What about my trash? Am I a veg? Stuff like that. Who is it that are ruining YOUR festival?

Btw Christian Forslund (Not the one with the guitar): What about reading the all answers thoroughly before repeating that young punk spilling beer on your shoes while stating that he only uses common sense on demand...? icon_smile.gif

[This article was edited 1 times, at last 12.07.2012 at 17:36.]
Written on: 12.07.2012 18:00
Christian
Posts: 106
Schwing wrote:

Slight of topic: Christian with the guitar, are you up for a little challenge? Try to make an discription of me as a festival goer: Where do I camp t? What music do I hear on my stero? What did I hear on the stages this year/or what would I like to hear on the stages? What about my trash? Am I a veg? Stuff like that. Who is it that are ruining YOUR festival?


I do not have enough solid knowledge about you to be able to make a description that would be anything other than a guess. And when you "challenge" me like that it seems obvious that you do not feel like you fit into the douchebag category. So I have no reason to even try...where is my incentive to guess? What do I get out of it other than an answer telling me that I am wrong, which I probably will be if I tried. I already know that.

I just reacted to your own description of your behavior. I know for sure that you acted like an asshole if you really did the things you said. I really don't care if you eat meat, listen to Prince or Behemoth, like to wear dresses and blonde curly wigs or anything else.

Your personality does not have any effect on my festival experience if you behave nicely towards us other festival-participants. It is only your behavior that can change other peoples opinion of you. That is the only part of you that they see and therefore the only part of you that they react to.

But hey, my guess is that you are a nice guy that uses the festival as an excuse to act out and do what you feel like. That promotes an egotistical behavior which makes you act like an asshole without changing your self-image because...hey, that is just the way it is on a festival.

How close am I?
Written on: 12.07.2012 19:40
Christian Forslund
Posts: 342
Schwing wrote:

Edit: I haven't time to read Alex Langbergs post - we posted at the same time so there might be slight risk of me repeating him - dunno

Well where to start...

It seems like there is some sort of problem with all the soundsystems - It also seems like some part of the problem could be solved by increasing sound quality and avoid repetition of the same songs, but most of the answers in this thread blame selfish douchebag-camps - camps that I somehow seem to be the incarnation of on this forum, more of that later. I pointed out that politeness was part of the problem but as Ulrik Rasmussen mentioned: Some people are just beyond reasoning and I'm sorry to hear that you lived next to such camp Ulrik.
To prevent such things happen next year (We can, however, never totally prevent it) I believe many of the solutions in this thread are great: A growth in silent and clean area, especially combined with a loud and dirty area. That would require some sort of 'patrolling' and enforcing in the 'normal' and S&C areas, but it should be possible. An easy-to-get permit as Saturnus suggested could probably also decrease the growth of soundsystems. Some kind of reward or 'carrot' as Hed mentioned, could also be a good solution I think, but how it should work I really don't know, and it probably can't stand alone.

Slight of topic: Christian with the guitar, are you up for a little challenge? Try to make an discription of me as a festival goer: Where do I camp t? What music do I hear on my stero? What did I hear on the stages this year/or what would I like to hear on the stages? What about my trash? Am I a veg? Stuff like that. Who is it that are ruining YOUR festival?

Btw Christian Forslund (Not the one with the guitar): What about reading the all answers thoroughly before repeating that young punk spilling beer on your shoes while stating that he only uses common sense on demand...? icon_smile.gif

At Roskilde I went to bed after the concerts at 3-4 AM and just after I went to bed, a loud sound system would start and play for a few hours, where even my efficient earplugs could give me enough peace to sleep, so I must ask is it not ok to want to sleep at RF, and isn't it common sense to turn your sound machine down at four in the night?
The reason I included, that you may be the young-punk type, was your own description. Nobody has to earn any respect at Roskilde and especially not in order to be allowed to ask people to turn their stereo down. It must be common sense to show some consideration to other people at the festival.
Written on: 12.07.2012 21:52
Coldblooded
Posts: 1229
Alex Langberg wrote:

What happened to the concept of loud enough? We have a small boomblaster and a bigger backpack, both home-built, based on digital amps and SLA batteries/solar cells. The boomblaster plays loud enough during the day for 20 people to listen to the radio or their own music at reasonable levels at a quite high sound quality. The backpack can easily play up a party of 30 people. I could carry both on my bike without a problem if I wanted to. It's loud enough.

Now, I'm all up for larger stereos. There just has to be a reason. I love the Boominator, the Coffin, Kilowattgruppen, Karmakanonen etc. I've even seen a dollhouse with speakers in the windows, Thomas the Train, the tower from Mordor and even an old piano with speakers built in, that was almost impossible to move. I probably forgot a lot of the amazing stereos you see out there but many of them are amazing in their own regard. Some because of the sheer technical ingenuity such as the first ones mentioned and some because of the artistical skill involved as in the last ones mentioned. Some because of the amazing level of pure, intentional stupidity, such as the piano. In my world all these have something in common - they make you stop and wonder and laugh in amazement. You want to take pictures, talk to the creators and bring your friends to see it. It's very much in the spirit of the festival, because it brings people together. I love that part of it.

What I don't like is the now huge amount of stereos that are simply made to play loud. I have no count of how many camps I have walked past who have big horns or maybe just a box the size of a car, with a tower of car/truck batteries next to it. They turn the stereo out towards everybody else and play so loud music that you will damage your hearing just walking past it. While they all sit in their camp, just chilling on the other side of the speakers. Yes, your stereo can play really loud. Big deal. It's not amazing or fascinating in any kind of way. We passed the "wow, that stereo is loud"-point many years ago. It's like people think that a big, loud stereo will be enough to start a party by itself.

There are many problems with this:

1. The louder you play, the bigger your responsibility for the people around you. These stereos play insanely loud and will damage your and everyone else's ears while making people around you unable to sleep. Often for no reason at all. It's my impression that the sound pressure level is a lot higher than in front of the orange stage and often with distortion that makes it a lot worse. Yet there are no sound engineers to ensure that people will not get hurt. I know that many of the camps I have mentioned before actively monitor their stereos during parties to make sure everybody has a good time but it is my impression that a vast majority of the camps with loud stereos don't care about others at all.

2. It's in no way good for the environment. I used to work as an orange vest and I was amazed that people would sometimes just dump their car batteries. Just throw them in the mud so they turned over and the acid ran out in the ground. Then we'd have to pick them up and carry them all the way to the tower. With the invention of digital amplifiers, I have a hard time finding any rational argument why unsealed batteries should still be allowed - especially at a festival that focuses so much on the environment. You can easily make do with SLA batteries or different variations of lithium-batteries. With a digital amp, it's actually cheaper in the long run. Also, extreme amounts of energy is wasted that could simply be collected by solar cells instead.

3. This is definitely an arms race that will only turn worse every year. It already is. I fear that the end result might be a ban on sound systems or partial bans that take the fun out of it. Like, almost all other festivals.

So what can we do?

I think the festival should take the competitive element of it and make it theirs. Change the competition from being about playing the loudest and turn it into a contest of being innovative, environmental and creative. Like, you know, everything else on the festival. Give us challenges. Enforce a ban on unsealed batteries. Enforce volume restrictions. Make it such that stereos larger than what one person can lift requires review from the festival in advance. Make it a privilege to have a big stereo. Make competitions about who can play the loudest for the longest on 10 AAA batteries. There are so many options. It's all about being unique and rules can often create enormous sparks of creativity. I'd gladly help. Just, please, do SOMETHING before it gets out of hand. It's already something that's really unique to this festival. Please embrace it before you have to reject it completely like other festivals do.

I so agree with everything you say, and I actually have a few ideas to turn the sound systems arms race upside down. I'll be back!
Written on: 18.07.2012 11:16
Christiiine
Posts: 21
jazon wrote:

Christian wrote:

Christiiine wrote:

I think I had the worst soundsystem as a neighbour, it was called apollo and was Roskildes own soundsystem. it destroyed my festival from wednesday until sunday. I would be so happy to hear all the boominators instead.


Yeah, you lived right in the line of fire. I noticed your camp when we walked by and I remember thinking that you would have had to leave your camp whenever the music was playing on Apollo. If I were you I would write the festival and ask for a refund (or maybe just a ticket for next year?) because of it.

We lived in C65 (maybe 200 meter to the side of the stage) and I almost couldn't fall asleep saturday night even though I was drunk as a skunk. The air mattress just kept bouncing and that is not supposed to be happening unless I am the one making it bounce!


if you cant beet them join them !!! i lovd apollo !!! yhhee had some trubel sleeping 1 or 2 times but if you cant sleep wake the fuck up and party !!!


Lol, are you serious? With the heat during the day I need to get some sleep at night. Wien the concerts ends around 4am and the sun makes it impossible to sleep for days, I will say that's a problem. Luckily they are moving the stage next year, so people who wants to "join the party" can do that. For me the worst part was that we couldn't talk to anyone, since the music was too loud. The year before the c tower closed down the coffin camp, because we played too loud. This year the tower was right next to Apollo. I know the coffin makes a lot of noise, but come on. We're not even close to Apollo.
Written on: 18.07.2012 13:28
Steen H
Official RF person
Posts: 35
Hey guys

I'm part of the group called Publikumscamping. We are responsible for the planning and execution of all guest camping areas on the festival, including coordination of all stakeholders like shops, entertainment, installations, events, safety and so on. My particular area is M.

I just wanted to let you guys know that we are indeed watching, learning from your experiences and absorbing every cool idea and suggestion that arise in here. We tend not to involve ourselves actively in the forums, except for answering questions on pratical issues. We kinda like the idea that the discussions are driven by you guys.

So rest assured - we feel you - even if you sometimes doesn't feel us in here icon_smile.gif

Please continue this thread. There has been a lot of great input so far, so keep it up!

Hope you all have a great summer!

Best regards
Steen
Written on: 18.07.2012 14:02
The Rehabilitation of Luis Suarez
Posts: 2506
Steen H wrote:

Hey guys

I'm part of the group called Publikumscamping. We are responsible for the planning and execution of all guest camping areas on the festival, including coordination of all stakeholders like shops, entertainment, installations, events, safety and so on. My particular area is M.

I just wanted to let you guys know that we are indeed watching, learning from your experiences and absorbing every cool idea and suggestion that arise in here. We tend not to involve ourselves actively in the forums, except for answering questions on pratical issues. We kinda like the idea that the discussions are driven by you guys.

So rest assured - we feel you - even if you sometimes doesn't feel us in here icon_smile.gif

Please continue this thread. There has been a lot of great input so far, so keep it up!

Hope you all have a great summer!

Best regards
Steen


Thanks, Steen.

I don't, however, mind if you, the official staff, got more involved here on the forum. You can throw thoughts and ideas as well as concerns at us, and we'll discuss it and give our opinions.

I would like that. There is a lot of experience on this forum
Written on: 18.07.2012 14:22
Martin Horn Pedersen
Official RF person
Posts: 1273
Top Secret Identity wrote:


Thanks, Steen.

I don't, however, mind if you, the official staff, got more involved here on the forum. You can throw thoughts and ideas as well as concerns at us, and we'll discuss it and give our opinions.

I would like that. There is a lot of experience on this forum


I like that the don´t get in to a debate like this. But yes if they have a new idear it might be a good idea to ask around before do it.

My job as Official RF person is being forum moderator

Written on: 18.07.2012 19:24
Thomas Atkinson
Posts: 10
Martin Horn Pedersen wrote:

Top Secret Identity wrote:


Thanks, Steen.

I don't, however, mind if you, the official staff, got more involved here on the forum. You can throw thoughts and ideas as well as concerns at us, and we'll discuss it and give our opinions.

I would like that. There is a lot of experience on this forum


I like that the don´t get in to a debate like this. But yes if they have a new idear it might be a good idea to ask around before do it.

My job as Official RF person is being forum moderator




Sorry Martin, but you really need to change that "title" on your picture. Now we have two "Official RF persons", but only one is actually involved with the festival. It is misleading to say the least. Also, you might very well end up arguing two different sides of a case and therefore lead people like me to think that RF don't have an official line in the matter at hand.

In any case, Steen. Please get involved in this discussion.


Written on: 18.07.2012 20:25
Martin Horn Pedersen
Official RF person
Posts: 1273
Thomas Atkinson wrote:



Sorry Martin, but you really need to change that "title" on your picture. Now we have two "Official RF persons", but only one is actually involved with the festival. It is misleading to say the least. Also, you might very well end up arguing two different sides of a case and therefore lead people like me to think that RF don't have an official line in the matter at hand.

In any case, Steen. Please get involved in this discussion.


I asked my boss(they guys responsible for the website) if the title could be chance to Moderator that and he said it was not possible(Yes the forum is not perfect). So you have to accept that is like this. And there is more whit the "Official RF person" on the forum then Steen and me, most just don’t post very much.

My job as Official RF person is being forum moderator
Written on: 18.07.2012 20:51
Saturnus
Posts: 3048
Thomas, it's only 'cos you're a newb here that you find offense. Most of the forum users knew Martin long before he became a moderator here. I'm pretty sure not many here are confused about his role.
Written on: 19.07.2012 13:09
The Rehabilitation of Luis Suarez
Posts: 2506
Thomas Atkinson wrote:

Martin Horn Pedersen wrote:

Top Secret Identity wrote:


Thanks, Steen.

I don't, however, mind if you, the official staff, got more involved here on the forum. You can throw thoughts and ideas as well as concerns at us, and we'll discuss it and give our opinions.

I would like that. There is a lot of experience on this forum


I like that the don´t get in to a debate like this. But yes if they have a new idear it might be a good idea to ask around before do it.

My job as Official RF person is being forum moderator




Sorry Martin, but you really need to change that "title" on your picture. Now we have two "Official RF persons", but only one is actually involved with the festival. It is misleading to say the least. Also, you might very well end up arguing two different sides of a case and therefore lead people like me to think that RF don't have an official line in the matter at hand.

In any case, Steen. Please get involved in this discussion.





Sorry, but take a step back. Seriously. We all know Martin, and he is not pretending to be anyone else than he in fact is.

It sounds like you are sour from making a few mistakes.
Written on: 19.07.2012 13:10
The Rehabilitation of Luis Suarez
Posts: 2506
Martin Horn Pedersen wrote:

Thomas Atkinson wrote:



Sorry Martin, but you really need to change that "title" on your picture. Now we have two "Official RF persons", but only one is actually involved with the festival. It is misleading to say the least. Also, you might very well end up arguing two different sides of a case and therefore lead people like me to think that RF don't have an official line in the matter at hand.

In any case, Steen. Please get involved in this discussion.


I asked my boss(they guys responsible for the website) if the title could be chance to Moderator that and he said it was not possible(Yes the forum is not perfect). So you have to accept that is like this. And there is more whit the "Official RF person" on the forum then Steen and me, most just don’t post very much.

My job as Official RF person is being forum moderator


I am surprised that my secret identity hasn't been questioned by him yet icon_biggrin.gif
Written on: 19.07.2012 14:00
Rockmus
Posts: 290
I love the chaotic party during the warm-up days, but yes this has gone too far!

Way too many camps try to throw "The-Big-Party" every night by having a loud sound system. But hell did I go past many camps that was playing at an absolute stupid high (and very distorted) level this year where they at the same time sat five guys drinking beers in the camp behind the sound system - STUPID, I must say!

If you want to make a big sound system, I think it would be fine if you had to get a permit from the festival first. This way we could weed out the weak parties, because The Coffin (earlier years), Promilleservice, a lot of stuff in L I didn't know have given me fantastic parties which I really have enjoyed. But they have also been thrown by people who provided the camping ground with something new i.e. that Mordor Camp I didn't found but everybody was talking about.

...but please remove those idiots who is playing backstreet boys above the speakers capability at 4 am! I was much more pleased when our stoned swedish neighbors were trying to sing Kim Larsen songs in Danish icon_biggrin.gif
Written on: 20.07.2012 01:50
cup of coffee
Posts: 101
Roskilde just have to make new rule: No loud music between 4am---> and let's say ->12pm.

I guess that would be good rule for everyone, because at 4-5am everyone will fall asleep if they try. So people get better sleep. Ok there's probably some people on extasy or speed who can't fall asleep that easily... But drunken people will do.


And I'm one of the guys who played music extremely loud at one night (morning), around 4-6am.. And I'm not proud of it. We had big speakers, and the sound quality was great, but still. So that rule would make a drunken dumbasses like me go to sleep earlier!
Written on: 21.07.2012 22:41
Alex Langberg
Posts: 13
Christiiine wrote:

Lol, are you serious? With the heat during the day I need to get some sleep at night. Wien the concerts ends around 4am and the sun makes it impossible to sleep for days, I will say that's a problem. Luckily they are moving the stage next year, so people who wants to "join the party" can do that. For me the worst part was that we couldn't talk to anyone, since the music was too loud. The year before the c tower closed down the coffin camp, because we played too loud. This year the tower was right next to Apollo. I know the coffin makes a lot of noise, but come on. We're not even close to Apollo.


We actually talked about this in our camp, since we were pretty close to you guys the year you were told to turn it down. It's quite ironic. And we were like "what the faaaaa..." when we saw the Apollo stage. We were not so unhappy about being in B after that. I wonder who thought this was a good idea. The guys in the tower were probably given equipment to deal with the noise but it must have been a nightmare to have smoke EVERYWHERE. I've been working in the towers and I can't even imagine what it must have looked like from there when the smoke from Apollo was drifting all over C, as it sometimes did. I loved the coffin this year though. You guys certainly don't lack a sense of humor. icon_biggrin.gif

[This article was edited 1 times, at last 21.07.2012 at 22:41.]
Written on: 20.11.2012 11:34
Caroline Rasmussen
Posts: 3
To be honest, I don't think it's a possibility to say to the campers which sound systems are allowed and which are not.

There should be room for everyone, and if the festival is actually going to do something to make everyone happy, I believe the best opportunity would be to make different areas. Clean and silent, some for the ones with big ass sound systems, and some for the ones in between.


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